This might be all very well and dandy for those of us who are not obese and who don't smoke. However, here's why it's farking disgraceful:
1 BMI is an arbitrary bollocks indicator of obesity, and should not be used as a criteria for assessing fatness.
2 The NHS, the last time I looked, provides universal health care. These restrictions are fundamentally contrary to the principles of the NHS.
3 Smokers pay tax on the fags they smoke, are they not already therefore providing extra funding for their health issues from their smoking habit?
4 This is but the thin end of the wedge. As we all know Nanny has bees in her bonnet wrt eating, drinking, lifestyle etc. In the event that NHS Devon is allowed to get away with this, Nanny will target those who drink and eat fat/sugar for "lifestyle changes" before allowing them to receive medical help for which they have paid taxes.
Ignore this at your peril, one day Nanny will identify something that you do that she will classify as a "health risk"!
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Talk about outrageous. These fatties and smokers have no doubt been paying taxes and NI and so are entitled to healthcare regardless. BMI as you rightly say is a poor measure of body lean to fat ratio. Conductivity gives an accurate measure. It can be rather difficult to operate on very fat people but that's all it is, difficult but not impossible. Giving up smoking is good because non-smokers do heal quicker. It's because of oxygen transfer being more efficient in non smokers because there is no carboxymethaemoglobin to contend with. I think 8 weeks is excessive though.
ReplyDeleteFirst I'll declare my interest; I am over weight caused by the fact I have mobility issues and that the hole under my nose is bigger than the one in the middle of my arse.
ReplyDeleteI feel this is a sinister development and I see NHS Devon as the "toe in the water" trust to see what would happen and how it would be received by the public. If they get a green light, then it would be rolled out nationwide.
It begs the question, if they get away with the fatties and the smokers, who will be next?.....The drinkers, the drugies, the sportsmen/sportswomen, members of a political party?
I personally would welcome being deprived of treatment by the NHS if they refunded my lifelong contributions so that I could make alternative arrangements. I wonder if trading standards Nanny would allow a private business to deprive customers of something they've paid for?
A surgeon has always been allowed to make the decision on whether to operate on someone who is obese. If the risks outweigh the benefits then the obese person does not receive treatment.
ReplyDeleteHowever, this particular NHS trust now wants to move the goalposts and refuse treatment to anyone who has a lifestyle that they do not agree with.
I am sure that their decision is illegal, and will eventually be challenged.
Can the obese and smokers in Devon ask for a deduction in their NHS contributions, based on the fact that they will not receive full treatment?
Can the patients ask that they do not receive treatment from any member of NHS staff that may like to drink alcohol or take ‘prescription’ drugs to keep them going through a double shift?
This is another example of a NHS trust that has no idea where their funding comes from, and what their obligations are to the public.
It is a long time ago that the NHS was set up, consequently, many forget that it is not free. If I, as a smoker, had a private health insurance, I would pay a premium plus a supplement for the fact that I MAY have a higher risk due to my guilty pleasure. It would be interesting to compare how much I would pay for this compared to my National Insurance plus the amount of extra tax I have paid over the years on the tobacco I have bought.
ReplyDeleteIt is a difficult calculation to make - premiums rise as you get older,reflecting the increasing chance of needing healthcare.If there was a one-off lifetime premium,losing the estimated last 10 years through smoking may save overall,especially if you take account of the funding of old folks homes and the state pension
DeleteWith private medical insurance it is clear how much you are paying, but with the NHS it is impossible to calculate an individual’s contributions because it is not funded from just one source.
ReplyDeleteAll governments, past and present, seem to think that the way to ensure more votes is to throw as much money as possible at the NHS.
With 1.4 million ‘workers’ a significant amount of this money is wasted on useless administration and management.
The NHS is a monster which is now completely out of control. As an example, if the employees were to get the 1% pay increase that they are demanding it is a very small amount of money for an individual, but the same amount of money would pay for an additional 1,400 nurses (at least).
The only way that the NHS can improve is if it is made more efficient. Money must be taken from proactive campaigns and put into reactive health care. All superfluous jobs should be lost and every penny of taxpayer’s money that is put into the service should be strictly monitored and accounted for.
Devon NHS are saying that they are taking the extreme measures stated because they need to hit targets, but trying to improve anything by setting targets is a very short term solution. Institutions soon become very adept at manipulating targets whilst becoming increasingly negligent in the roles that they are supposed to fulfil.
The NHS is indeed a political football.
DeleteWhat we need, in my opinion, is a grown up debate as to just what we want the NHS to do. Do we want to fund everything that is medical or health related or should we be more choosey? Should we fund IVF, cosmetic surgery, sex change ops, sporting accidents and injuries, car crash related injuries? These are the questions that need to be answered....Do we need sports associations to pay an additional insurance for injuries caused whilst playing football or rugby for example? Should smokers, drinkers and fatties pay a premium be it as individuals or through product taxes for their lifestyle choice? Should people engaging in risky sexual practices pay more?
From my point of view, today we expect far too much from the NHS and the NHS has morphed into a giant, cash hungry monster it was never intended to be.
Please note, I neither support nor oppose these suggestions, I merely moot them as the kind of grown up discussion as nation, we need however, because the NHS has been so politicised and because we have been conditioned by politicians to believe the more money we throw at something the better, we are unlikely to get such a debate.
As someone who has worked within the NHS as well as private psychiatric services, I know that the NHS wastes a huge amount of money in admin and management in relation to box ticking. They also waste a lot of money in PC indoctrination courses which staff are forced to attend rather than getting on with treating patients.
Finally, we don't just need a grown up debate about what we want the NHS to do for us, we also need a debate about what we expect from the state overall and how much government we actually want/need. Personally, I would like to see much less government.
Is the political system in this country capable any longer of having a mature debate on anything? Your reply is excellent, but I just don't think they have the intellectual capability to consider complex issues like this in an adult way.
DeleteAnon,
DeleteSadly, I have to agree withy you. The Party System has, for all intents and purposes, completely killed off our democracy within the UK however, the real irony is that, at the same time, we go around the world trying to impose democracy on others.
Typo......The above should read an additional 14,000 nurses, not 1,400.
ReplyDelete